Before Justin Walters and Paul Hickey founded Bespoke Investment Group, they worked at Birinyi & Associates. This was around 2005 or 2006, something like that. They did a weekly survey of bloggers, bullish and bearish, I recall this starting very close to the start of the bear market associated with the Financial Crisis. Every week for more than a year I was bearish. Bearish, bearish, bearish, week after week and I believe I was deemed as being the most accurate of the group.
Then at some point I flipped to bullish, probably very close to when this article posted at Seeking Alpha on 12/28/2008 titled 2009: Expecting a Massive Rally. When I did switch to bullish for this survey, Paul and Justin mentioned in the email that went out asking for survey participants to respond. I don't recall how much longer the survey went on but I am pretty sure I stayed bullish for the duration until the survey ended.
This is similar to how I have viewed and blogged about the middle of the yield curve and further out going back close to 20 years. Locking in for ten years at 4.50%-5% (this was 2006 and early 2007) made no sense to me. It seemed like not enough compensation for the potential volatility and then yields went lower for many more years. Then of course yields bottomed and started to go higher causing pretty big price declines in long dated bonds and many bond funds. I certainly missed capital gains by avoiding that part of the bond market but I am not looking to bonds for capital gains. For me, bonds are about mitigating the volatility from the equity portion of the portfolio, the portion where I do want capital gains to come from. Cool for anyone who is looking for gains from bonds, that's just not what I am looking for. I am looking for yield, yield equivalents and predictability.
Neither of these seem like market timing in the manner in which the phrase is commonly used. Please leave a comment if you disagree with that contention.
The prompt for all of this came from the following thread.
Elsewhere in the thread, Corey mentions LDI, liability driven investing where durations/maturities are matched to income (liability) needs. LDI is typically associated with pensions and maybe also endowments. I'm sure Corey is using the term in the correct context so then it is up to the end user what they want to do. Trying to time interest rates is definitely very difficult to do with any consistency. The yield on the ten year Treasury is 4.41% as I type this. Someone says they're going to go in in at 4.75% or sell at 4.20%, that is a short term strategy that is a form of trying to time interest rates.
What we argue for here is assessing risk. I've made comments here and there about maybe 7% being an attractive point where risk for longer term bonds would be fairly compensated. Maybe it would 6.5% if we ever got there or maybe 7.25%? I'm not expecting anything like that, more like if it ever happened, I would be interested.
If/when the Fed starts cutting, how low will they go? I don't know but I'm pretty sure it won't be zero. I'm pretty sure it won't be 1% either. I'm less certain about 2% but that seems like a stretch unless there is another calamity that extends beyond capital markets. When Fed Funds were at zero, there was yield without duration available in the threes and even into the fours. If Fed Funds goes down as low as 2%, there will be yield without duration in the fours and fives, probably higher but you need to spread your exposures around.
In that context, I draw a much different conclusion about needing to match LDI in retail sized advisory client accounts by locking in ten years at 4.41% for treasuries or 5.4% for A rated corporates (per Fidelity).
Ben Hunt had a doozy of a thread that led him to conclude that we are in for a stagflationary outcome. As we mentioned the other day, Torsten Slot said that in the face of stagflation, we should expect interest rates to go up and stocks to go down.
We've been talking a good bit about quadrant-inspired portfolios over the last few months and if Hunt and Slok turn out to be correct about stagflation, the concept will probably get a lot more attention.
I built out the following variation on a quadrant portfolio to compare to VBAIX which is a proxy for a 60/40 portfolio and inflation. I didn't know this was available but I typed in the work inflation and there is was.
A portfolio with 40% equities is not very likely to keep up with one that is 60% equities but that isn't the point. The quadrant inspired portfolio above will hopefully be more resilient in times of strife. In 2008, it was down 13% versus 21% for VBAIX and in 2022 it was down 4% versus 16% for VBAIX. For what it's worth, the Permanent Portfolio Fund (PRPFX) was down just under 9% in 2008 and in 2022 it was down 5%.
The long term CAGR for the 40/20/20/20 versus PRPFX being almost identical is interesting but 40/20/20/20 had considerably less volatility. The real return of the backtest is pretty good and would become important if we do go through a lost decade or stagflationary event.
In the real world, I would diversify the diversifiers and I would split the 40% to equities to include foreign stocks.
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